• surph_ninja@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    I’m getting pretty fucking sick of seeing this ‘no one should be killed for their political beliefs’ take going around.

    He wasn’t killed for his beliefs. He was killed because he dedicated his life to terrorizing everyone who isn’t a conservative white man, and was materially supporting state violence in the pursuit of white supremacy.

    That is 100% something we have firmly established that people should be shot for, in multiple wars throughout the last few centuries.

    • deaf_fish@midwest.social
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      10 months ago

      There was a way around this that would have resulted in no deaths. Trump should been prosecuted for the January 6th insurrection. Then we should have put a bunch of fascists in jail for a long time. Then we should have de-platformed grifters.

      But none of that happens so. We get what we get.

      • surph_ninja@lemmy.world
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        10 months ago

        We’re never better off with the Dem fascists in charge either. They’re two sides of the same coin.

        If we want the law to mean anything, and we want it used to hold people accountable, over 90% of sitting congresspeople and senators can now be prosecuted for aiding genocide, which they did in violation of domestic & international laws. That would certainly set a tone and precedent for the future.

        • deaf_fish@midwest.social
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          10 months ago

          Slight nitpick. Though I agree with the whole “we’re never better off with the Dem fascists in charge either.” In the long term. In the short term there are a lot of innocent people in US concentration camps and whom have been deported. Who would strongly disagree with you.

          • surph_ninja@lemmy.world
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            10 months ago

            Biden deported 250% more people than Trump’s first term, and Stephen Miller was reportedly screaming at a meeting with ICE leadership because he was pissed they were barely keeping pace with Biden’s deportation numbers.

            The Democrat fascists have troves of victims, too, but the media only gives them a microphone when they’re victims of Republicans.

            • deaf_fish@midwest.social
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              10 months ago

              Biden deported them without going to the legal process? Like I’m pro-immigration so I get it. But there’s a big difference from deporting people via the legal process. Versus picking up some guy who’s a US citizen who has a tattoo of his mom on his shoulder. Calling him a gang member and then sending him to some other country to a slave prison without due process.

              Neither Biden or Trump are good, but it’s really hard to argue that things would be just as bad today under Biden or Harris then they are under Trump. And Trump’s not even done with the first year of his second term.

        • Lumisal@lemmy.world
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          10 months ago

          We were better off with the Dems in charge. The difference is it’s like having your feet on fire vs full emolation. But the point is it’s easier to extinguish feet than it is the whole body, and causes less damage too.

          And by this I mean peace was still a possible, if unlikely, resolution.

          • surph_ninja@lemmy.world
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            10 months ago

            I bet the people being actively killed and oppressed by the Dems would disagree. It sounds more like you personally felt less threatened under Dems, and you want to return to that place of privilege.

            When the ICE raids began, Democrats published a public thank you letter to the agents. If you think this will get better with Dems in charge, you aren’t paying attention.

    • LuyaPapi@social.friendcraft.clubBanned from community
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      10 months ago

      @surph_ninja @jballs How exactly did Charlie Kirk “terrorize” anyone? It was just words, dude! Dramatic much? Charlie Kirk engaged in dialogue. He welcomed conversation, even when he disagreed. He was killed because he called out the lunacy of our culture.

      I feel like I am living in the story of The Emperors New Clothes and the people who actually call out the stupidity are being made fun of…and killed now. You need to get a grip on reality.

      • surph_ninja@lemmy.world
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        10 months ago

        He created a literal hitlist of professors, and convinced people that violence against trans people was a moral imperative.

        • LuyaPapi@social.friendcraft.clubBanned from community
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          10 months ago

          @surph_ninja a hitlist? He may have named people he felt were contributing to the rot of this nation, but you show me proof that he ever called for a hit or for people to do anything more than speak against the issues.

            • LuyaPapi@social.friendcraft.clubBanned from community
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              10 months ago

              @surph_ninja The purpose of https://www.professorwatchlist.org/ was simply to “expose and document college professors who discriminate against conservative students and advance leftist propaganda in the classroom.” You have no proof that he ever pushed followers to do anything vile or hateful to those professors.

              Even if his followers did, that doesn’t mean he condoned it. Show us proof. Less talk, more evidence. #lies #propaganda #turningpointusa #charliekirk

              • surph_ninja@lemmy.world
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                10 months ago

                Nah. He’s dead now. He won’t hurt anyone again. No need to prove it anymore, now that the trash has been taken out. Good riddance.

                • LuyaPapi@social.friendcraft.clubBanned from community
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                  10 months ago

                  @surph_ninja What kind of a person makes unqualified accusations against a dead man without providing any proof? And then we asked about evidence, dismisses the need to validate claims against someone’s character?

                  You are a bitter, hateful person and from what I see you are much closer to the type of person you claim Charlie was than he has ever been. I pity you. I honestly feel bad for you.

  • merc@sh.itjust.works
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    10 months ago

    Great foreshadowing too.

    Earlier this year, Utah passed House Bill 128 allowing people to conceal carry firearms on university campuses. One of the campuses where conceal carry was now permitted is, of course, Utah Valley University, where Charlie Kirk was visiting today. He was sitting under a tent with the slogan “Prove Me Wrong”.

    Immediately before the shooting, he was taking questions from the audience:

    “Do you know how many transgender Americans have been mass shooters over the last 10 years?” an audience member asked. Kirk responded, “Too many.”

    The questioner followed up: “Do you know how many mass shooters there have been in America over the last 10 years?”

    “Counting or not counting gang violence?” Kirk asked.

    Then a single shot rang out.

    https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/conservative-activist-charlie-kirk-shot-at-utah-valley-university-event-spokesperson-says

    It’s unfortunate that he’s ineligible for the Darwin Award because he leaves behind 2 very young children and a culture warrior wife, because otherwise he’d be a great nominee for the 2025 Darwin Awards. Normally to get a Darwin Award someone has to directly kill themselves. But, I think in this case we could have make an exception for someone who was a cheerleader for gun rights and was sitting directly under a banner saying “Prove Me Wrong” when he was killed with a gun.

  • shittydwarf@piefed.social
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    10 months ago

    Holy shit, I’m in the middle of buttfuck nowhere with no internet for days, and THIS is the news that comes through when I reconnect?! Perhaps I treated this timeline too harshly

  • joan@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    Hi guys! Just because he was an awful person doesn’t mean he deserves to die. I am actually horrified by how many people are condoning this, especially when this man has a family and a wife and it’s not even like trump when it would have actually done anything for our country. all this has done has made a gigantic fuss and give fox news rage bait.

    • WoodScientist@lemmy.world
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      10 months ago

      No, he actually, absolutely, objectively did deserve to die. Maybe not by vigilante justice, but he absolutely deserved to be in the ground. The world is a better place without him in it.

      Have you forgotten your history? We hanged people at Nuremberg for doing exactly what Kirk made his whole career doing. We hanged people at Nuremberg for crimes against humanity who did what Kirk did. We hanged Nazi propagandists who spent years inciting hate against the Jewish population. Kirk was absolutely guilty of incitement to genocide. He was responsible for countless deaths. He made his whole career trying to incite violence and hate against innocent people.

      In a just world he would hang for his crimes. But we don’t live in a just world. The closest we get to justice is vigilante justice.

      Vigilante justice is not something I welcome. But the man absolutely deserved to die. He was a mass murderer.

      • joan@lemmy.world
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        10 months ago

        This man wasn’t Hitler. This man was an annoying loudmouth who at the end of the day has a wife and kids he comes home to. He did not deserve this; this will only divide us more and contribute to the cycle of violence.

  • 58008@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    I feel bad that his children had to witness that, and even if they hadn’t been there (which they were) they’d undoubtedly have the video clip shoved in their faces eventually. That’s a hell of a way to lose a parent.

    The fact that he died while in the middle of talking about trans mass shooters being a huge problem certainly makes it feel like cosmic karma at work. I struggle to give a shit about the man himself being shot dead. But I do worry about political violence… it’s a very rare occasion when murdering someone sitting in a chair talking is a good idea. Not a single person in his right-wing sphere of repugnance is going to do any self-reflection and change their ways, they’ll just become even more rabidly anti-everything left of Hitler. Shit like this doesn’t go unanswered too often. Violence is a contagion with no cure except time, and the clock gets set back another decade every time someone retaliates. I’m sure we could chain all of these assassinations together into a causal sequence. But even if they’re all independent events, the narrative-makers will be hard at work making it sound like a grand battle of the ages, so the result is the same either way.

    Source: History, memory…

    P.S. Any bets that the shooter was a MAGA nut? Seems to be the trend 👀

    • outhouseperilous@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      10 months ago

      Speaking as someone with a shitty sociopath ‘parent’:

      They’ve seen enough its not too much escalation. And now they never have to deal with his bullshit again. The emotions will be complicated, but they won’t all be bad.

      You’re looking for someone to cry for. Cry for tye victims of this toxic shit. The kids he turned into nazis. The people who died on the street. The querrs who suffered abd possibly died in silence. All because this didnt happen sooner.

      Cry with joy for those that might live now. If you have that much surplus of tears.

    • bdonvr@thelemmy.club
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      10 months ago

      I feel bad that his children had to witness that, and even if they hadn’t been there (which they were) they’d undoubtedly have the video clip shoved in their faces eventually. That’s a hell of a way to lose a parent.

      It’s what he wanted. Quick, too.

      It is fucked for those kids though. Not their fault.