We owe it to one another to be good in turn. The value of family is in building up the cycle of mutual aid. It’s never a one-way street.
Why? You (not YOU but a parent) decided to procreate. Everything that follows is yours alone to deal with. I (the kid) never was asked to exist. Why do I owe you anything at all?
Yes. That gives them the conscious option, not the obligation.
Any expectant mother who miscarries can tell you why you’re wrong.
I spoke with many so far and wouldn’t know what that would have to do with anything?
Despite the tragedy of misscariage, it was still a one-way-decision to procreate. The result of it doesn’t touch the point. The resulting kid had no choice to exist or not to exist. It was first thrown into existence and then out of it again. It didn’t ask for either.
I don’t say kids shouldn’t be thankful or be in owing. They’re just no obliged to do so.
You can’t set a kid in this world, expecting it to pay you back somehow. It might, it probably will. It might also hate you for it. But it doesn’t HAVE to do any of it.
We’re all born into our various countries each of which places demands on us. And often that’s under threat of imprisonment or even death and with little of value in return. Yet people are patriotic and support that system. Even if some of us might say it is better that countries couldn’t do that, the fact that it’s widely supported means that there’s some basis for it that humanity recognizes.
Then compare that to a parent who selflessly loves and gives and gives. It’s very reasonable to say that parents are owed something.
Then compare that to a parent who selflessly loves and gives and gives. It’s very reasonable to say that parents are owed something.
That’s the thing. They’re not. You surely CAN be grateful and thankful and whatnot. Of course. But you don’t owe it to them. Were you asked if you want to exist? Were you asked if you want to be part of this society?
The rest you said isn’t wrong. I just fail to see the direct correlation between “i force you into this world without asking consent” and “because of that you owe me something”.
If I take you hostage and treat you super-well and lovely, do you owe me something?
Just because a baby can’t consent before being born, doesn’t automatically mean it has to be thankful for it. Doesn’t mean you mustn’t or couldn’t or even shouldn’t. But you don’t HAVE TO.
Still wouldn’t change that YOU alone forced life into existence. If it needs therapy, you’re at the absolute lowest root of a causal-chain.
Noone questions if you’re fully alone responsible for a pet you got. Even if it still bites you and won’t show “thankfulness”. But kids is just a thing that happens and it’s nobody’s fault or responsibility?
Why do you think it owes you gratitude? For the gift of life?
If you go amoral and unfeeling, all most people do is just breed slaves for our overlords and their desires in hopes they have someone that will take care of them later.
Besides, gratefulness for being birthed was kinda the topic of this thread. Kids that need to show some gratitude for aaaalll the love and care they received for being just another consumer and worker that will be milked until they’re dry.
But that’s another topic…
Why? You (not YOU but a parent) decided to procreate. Everything that follows is yours alone to deal with. I (the kid) never was asked to exist. Why do I owe you anything at all?
Because it’s the foundation of a functioning civilization.
That’s demonstrably not true.
Why should one’s offspring care for that? It never ask to be in that civilization?
If this makes you feel better? Doesn’t change the fact that procreating is a one-way-decision-street. Yours.
Because they’re human
Any expectant mother who miscarries can tell you why you’re wrong.
Yes. That gives them the conscious option, not the obligation.
I spoke with many so far and wouldn’t know what that would have to do with anything? Despite the tragedy of misscariage, it was still a one-way-decision to procreate. The result of it doesn’t touch the point. The resulting kid had no choice to exist or not to exist. It was first thrown into existence and then out of it again. It didn’t ask for either.
I don’t say kids shouldn’t be thankful or be in owing. They’re just no obliged to do so. You can’t set a kid in this world, expecting it to pay you back somehow. It might, it probably will. It might also hate you for it. But it doesn’t HAVE to do any of it.
We’re all born into our various countries each of which places demands on us. And often that’s under threat of imprisonment or even death and with little of value in return. Yet people are patriotic and support that system. Even if some of us might say it is better that countries couldn’t do that, the fact that it’s widely supported means that there’s some basis for it that humanity recognizes.
Then compare that to a parent who selflessly loves and gives and gives. It’s very reasonable to say that parents are owed something.
That’s the thing. They’re not. You surely CAN be grateful and thankful and whatnot. Of course. But you don’t owe it to them. Were you asked if you want to exist? Were you asked if you want to be part of this society? The rest you said isn’t wrong. I just fail to see the direct correlation between “i force you into this world without asking consent” and “because of that you owe me something”. If I take you hostage and treat you super-well and lovely, do you owe me something? Just because a baby can’t consent before being born, doesn’t automatically mean it has to be thankful for it. Doesn’t mean you mustn’t or couldn’t or even shouldn’t. But you don’t HAVE TO.
Because that’s how society works, mutualism.
I’m not stupid, but…who asked your offspring if it wants to be part of that? You forced it into existence.
Asking consent of the future is ridiculous, and being mad about existing means you need therapy.
Still wouldn’t change that YOU alone forced life into existence. If it needs therapy, you’re at the absolute lowest root of a causal-chain.
Noone questions if you’re fully alone responsible for a pet you got. Even if it still bites you and won’t show “thankfulness”. But kids is just a thing that happens and it’s nobody’s fault or responsibility?
Why do you think it owes you gratitude? For the gift of life?
Who said anything about gratitude? The continuation of the species is just what life is. The cycle is amoral and unfeeling.
If you go amoral and unfeeling, all most people do is just breed slaves for our overlords and their desires in hopes they have someone that will take care of them later.
Besides, gratefulness for being birthed was kinda the topic of this thread. Kids that need to show some gratitude for aaaalll the love and care they received for being just another consumer and worker that will be milked until they’re dry. But that’s another topic…