I keep hearing people say that the far-left is significantly less organised, more fragmented than the far-right. Why is that? (And to be clear: I’m asking about the far-left, not just the left in general (though they may be linked)
I keep hearing people say that the far-left is significantly less organised, more fragmented than the far-right. Why is that? (And to be clear: I’m asking about the far-left, not just the left in general (though they may be linked)
Not really, because you are actively deciding to take a stance on the palestine flags. You can just take part in the pride parade without doing that. Nobody requires you to do much more.
You don’t have to endorse anything. You just have to accept that other people are fighting some other fights additionally.
It is your personal view that specific people don’t belong at pride. Nobody thinks you specifically shouldn’t be there. You don’t need to participate in other topics. You are making up requirements that don’t exist.
It’s great to be “just” gay and go to pride. But you have to be okay with other people also being there, that might want to fight other oppression as well.
No but presence is read as assent. I wouldn’t join a right-leaning march if people were flying Nazi flags there either. It doesn’t matter that I don’t personally support them. By being there I effectively do.
And I’m not equating a Nazi flag to a Palestinian flag. It’s just a provocative example to highlight my point.
There is always some more extreme people at marches, so at a leftist march you are very likely to see other people fighting for more causes.
You don’t need to share their viewpoint, but you should be able to tolerate their existance as they are also fighting oppression and thus sharing similar goals as you are.
Do you disagree that the palestinians are fighting against oppression as well?
People in Palestine don’t have the ability to express themselves at all so their flag isn’t extremely misplaced at pride.
Once again, you don’t need to be more than supportive of the LGBTQ community to participate in pride. But you should be comfortable with seeing other leftists at these parades, as the fight for freedom from oppression is one of the main themes of leftism.
What is leftism if not the global fight against oppression?
I don’t know what else I can say to make my view clearer. There are people in those events that I don’t want to be associated with. If they would only focus on the pride thing and keep the rest of it to themselves, then I could choose to not care about it but they don’t and thus I wish to not partake.
Then you are quite opportunistic.
I understand your point but I disagree with the premise of it. There is a very famous quote by Martin Niemöller called “First They Came”, which describes very well why I disagree with you. You can’t just fight against the oppression you disagree with.
The fight for a free palestine is just as important as the fight for LGBTQ+ rights.
He just doesn’t want his cause being co-opted by another. It’s dishonest.
Co-opted by flags?
They weren’t even asked to leave or anything or were forced to agree with anything. Just tolerate people wanting to show their support for multiple causes at one parade.
There are also usually pride flags at other themed parades at least where I am from, so the point is pretty weak.
In a thread about leftists not working together, it isn’t very fitting to complain about leftists actually agreeing on different causes and walking together.
Being gay is not a left-wing position. A Pride march is a claim about sexual orientation and gender, not a general anti-oppression festival. By making it a left-wing event you’re making roughly 50% of sexual minorities not feel welcome there. Pride is supposed to be about tolerance and inclusivity but these people are making it conditional.
Pride flags being present in other events doesn’t weaken my argument but just further highlights it. That is exactly the same thing as flying a Palestinian flag in a Pride event. It does not belong there.
Do you know how pride started? Do you know why pride is still done?
If LGBTQ+ people had the same rights as straight people it would be a celebration of this. This is not the case though, so pride fights for equal rights for us and against the oppression of the state.
I don’t think it is a general anti-oppression festival, but that other fights against oppression aren’t really out of place there or are diluting the cause.
Which sexual minorities wouldn’t feel welcome at left-wing-events?